I may have a problem :-$

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic. 5517 views

  • Graeme
  • Administrator
  • Posts: 5,735
  • Liked: 1603
  • Thanks Given: 451
  • Received: 1325
  • Location: Newcastle
  • Tank Thread: https://reefbase.co.uk/members'-tanks-6/graeme's-6x2x2-840l/

Yesterday, this happened (lost my Clarkii):
Clownfish & Damselfish - ReefBase Marine Fish & Reef Keeping Forum!/

Later I moved my bimaculatus anthias, large brittle star, and coral out of quarantine, and into the main tank.  All seemed ok.  The anthias were nervous and hiding, but I expected that.

Today I can home to find one of the 4 anthias missing (checked the weir, sump, down the back and sides of the tank).  I wasn't too worried, as they tend to jam themselves against the bottom of rocks/underhangs, so I figured it was hiding somewhere.  Another one was jammed against the same rocks as they were hiding in yesterday, and two were out swimming around.

I then noticed my onespot foxface had a pale white mark on its tail. and what could have been a parasite on one side.  I decided to catch it and give it a saltwater and iodine dip (made up from DT water, and 5 drops of Lungol's iodine solution).  I left it in the dip for no more than 3 minutes, then straight back in the tank.  He floated down to the sandbed, keeled over, breathed heavily for a few minutes, spasmed and died  :embarrassed:

Whilst I was still reeling from having lost a fish that has been with me for 2 years now, and the Clarkii yesterday, the anthias that had been on the sandbed decided to swim around, and promptly got stuck to the powerhead and couldn't get free.  I pulled the plug, it swam off and I thought, stupid fish, you'll not  do that again...so it did.  I pulled the plug again, and it dropped to the sandbed and stuck to the weir intake.  I sumped it a minute later, to find it dead by dinner :cry:  No signs of damage or disease on it - I can only assume stress from the move yesterday.

What the hell is going on!!! :angry:  It all feels a little be too much to be coincidence  :undecided:

olyoz

  • Global Moderator
  • Posts: 865
  • Liked: 173
  • Thanks Given: 34
  • Received: 116
  • Tank Thread: https://reefbase.co.uk/members'-tanks-6/ollie's-ea-reef-1200s-upgrade/

Reply #1

Ah that sucks!   :cry:

carlcall

  • Posts: 1,885
  • Liked: 734
  • Thanks Given: 63
  • Received: 278

Reply #2

I'm going to keep my fingers crossed for you and I hope it is just a coincidence pal. Keep us updated please!

Mike

  • Administrator
  • Posts: 8,303
  • Liked: 1749
  • Thanks Given: 662
  • Received: 1128
  • Location: Manchester
  • Tank Thread: https://reefbase.co.uk/members'-tanks-6/i-conica's-tank-(picture-heavy!)/

Reply #3

This is very strange. I'm wondering what's going on too.

Do you have stray current, or some contamination, like dodgy plastic components, etc?
Donate to the running of ReefBase

HK_Fuey

  • Graeme
  • Administrator
  • Posts: 5,735
  • Liked: 1603
  • Thanks Given: 451
  • Received: 1325
  • Location: Newcastle
  • Tank Thread: https://reefbase.co.uk/members'-tanks-6/graeme's-6x2x2-840l/

Reply #4

 I don't think so.  No cheap or home made stuff in the tank. Had my hand in DT and sump over the last few days and not noticed any tingling.

Mike

  • Administrator
  • Posts: 8,303
  • Liked: 1749
  • Thanks Given: 662
  • Received: 1128
  • Location: Manchester
  • Tank Thread: https://reefbase.co.uk/members'-tanks-6/i-conica's-tank-(picture-heavy!)/

Reply #5

Something's a foot. You're not doing water changes are you? Maybe a build up or depletion of something. I'd start doing water changes to return the water to a default.   :lipsrsealed:
Donate to the running of ReefBase

Carol

  • Posts: 3,836
  • Liked: 982
  • Thanks Given: 412
  • Received: 566
  • Location: Lincolnshire

Reply #6

Anthias can be like bloody sheep  , ive had more than a few die for no good reason .


Your corals are very sensitive and they looked fine in the video the other day and the inverts i presume are fine?


Ok so its a fish issue if any at all....if its lack of vitamins and minerals tho i think we can discount the minerals , if the fish looked well fed  and were behaving Ok , no cloudyness of the  cornea of the eyes , no lumps under the throat,no unusual bloating eg looking a little too plump or slight raising of the scales...


Obviously your testing and its fine yer not a novice , id say the dipping process killed the Foxface , but its just my opinion , i tend to let things take thier course as often minor problems clear up with no interference , white patch can be injury , because consider what else it might be ?


Yes quite often there are no coincidences , but depletion of vitamins trace elements etc will i think show up in corals first or shrimps , things that have to shed , anything that has a fast metabolism .


And do hold on to the fact that Anthias do just drop dead to spite you  :angry:



Do not mock the snake because it has no horns.For who is to say that one day it may become a dragon,as one just man may become an army...Water Margin.

Thanks:


HK_Fuey

  • Graeme
  • Administrator
  • Posts: 5,735
  • Liked: 1603
  • Thanks Given: 451
  • Received: 1325
  • Location: Newcastle
  • Tank Thread: https://reefbase.co.uk/members'-tanks-6/graeme's-6x2x2-840l/

Reply #7

No signs of anything wrong with remaining fish.

Corals and inverts are all fine.  Trace elements build up of bad ones, or depletion of good ones could be a factor, but it does seem odd if the typically more sensitive species are all ok.

These anthias have always been skittish, so I wonder if the move, brighter lights, faster flow, etc. was too much for two of them?  The clarkii death is weird, as is the foxface, although it was almost certainly finished off by the dip (well, stress of).  Still feels a bit odd to me.

Carol

  • Posts: 3,836
  • Liked: 982
  • Thanks Given: 412
  • Received: 566
  • Location: Lincolnshire

Reply #8

Well if it was me I would not panic ,ask yourself what bad things you think have built up? Basicaly you have fish and coral waste , biological waste, this is in the way of phosphate  where fishy bones build up and breakdown same for any life form that requires calcium , well thats taken care of , no heavy metals you use RO water , nitrates are taken care of...


So outside factors , and I am sure you know these as well as I do , air freshners, polish,hairspray ,perfume , house flea sprays , whatever is taken in via the water surface in and on the dust that is naturaly in the air.


Now Ive seen a fish die as the result of  a neurotoxin , theres mad rushing about fitting panting and fairly rapid death , rather like watching a fly after its been flysprayed  . Lots of things tho can give the same outward signs , stroke , liver failure, even a heart attack , the natural reaction of an animal to pain is to run , to get away from it .


I feel its quite possibly a very bad run of luck because all the fish mentioned can be explained logicaly as to what happened . If you do not know the cause of it again dont panic into something that will cloud the real reason if there is one for any problems again if there are any .


Think back 6 weeks or so ...this is often the time period that something iffy can have happened but take that period of time to manifest .


The faster the metabolism and the shorter the lifespan the quicker the result of a "thing" you will get, remember how much heavy metals are in the fish in the oceans , and they live and breed ....


Sorry for the long post I can fully apreciate you  are feeling edgy and right not to just dismiss it . 
Do not mock the snake because it has no horns.For who is to say that one day it may become a dragon,as one just man may become an army...Water Margin.

Thanks:


HK_Fuey

  • Graeme
  • Administrator
  • Posts: 5,735
  • Liked: 1603
  • Thanks Given: 451
  • Received: 1325
  • Location: Newcastle
  • Tank Thread: https://reefbase.co.uk/members'-tanks-6/graeme's-6x2x2-840l/

Reply #9

Another anthias missing.

Carol, you're saying what I'd be saying to someone else.  I've added some carbon in case there is any build op of something bad in there - or maybe a toxin from softies fighting, etc.  The royal gramma and clarkii look perfect, as do the corals and inverts.  I sat watching one of my blackfoot trochus snails spawning today, which gave me some confidence that the water quality is good.

I've made one change that I can think of...About 3 weeks ago, I added about an inch of sand, over a two week period. 

Mike

  • Administrator
  • Posts: 8,303
  • Liked: 1749
  • Thanks Given: 662
  • Received: 1128
  • Location: Manchester
  • Tank Thread: https://reefbase.co.uk/members'-tanks-6/i-conica's-tank-(picture-heavy!)/

Reply #10

When in doubt, dilute it out...  :glad: I'd just err on the side of caution and do water changes whenever anything unexplained is happening, even if it later turns out not to have helped.  :lipsrsealed:
Donate to the running of ReefBase

carlcall

  • Posts: 1,885
  • Liked: 734
  • Thanks Given: 63
  • Received: 278

Reply #11

Quote from: HK_Fuey on Today at  9:14:27 pm
I've made one change that I can think of...About 3 weeks ago, I added about an inch of sand, over a two week period.

I couldn't see that doing anything surely.....unless you've stirred up the sandbed that was already there. But I don't think you will have done that though!

And in my eyes I couldn't see new sand causing anything, if anything it would've been a little cycle but not a harmful one surely?

Mike

  • Administrator
  • Posts: 8,303
  • Liked: 1749
  • Thanks Given: 662
  • Received: 1128
  • Location: Manchester
  • Tank Thread: https://reefbase.co.uk/members'-tanks-6/i-conica's-tank-(picture-heavy!)/

Reply #12

New sand can introduce silicates, which can trigger a diatom bloom (part the reason new tanks get diatom blooms) but not harmful to livestock really...
Donate to the running of ReefBase

HK_Fuey

  • Graeme
  • Administrator
  • Posts: 5,735
  • Liked: 1603
  • Thanks Given: 451
  • Received: 1325
  • Location: Newcastle
  • Tank Thread: https://reefbase.co.uk/members'-tanks-6/graeme's-6x2x2-840l/

Reply #13

I agree.  I have the diatom bloom.  Can't see anything else being a problem, but thought I'd mention it.

Hmm...I'm in tow minds.  One part of me says follow Mike's advice and do water changes to return to default.  The other part of me wants to continue without water changes, as I'm kind of on a mission to prove you don't need to do them if you get the ecosystem set up correctly. 

Does anyone know of any labs you can get a detailed water test done without having to sign up to anything long term?

carlcall

  • Posts: 1,885
  • Liked: 734
  • Thanks Given: 63
  • Received: 278

Reply #14

I know Triton do water tests @ about £35.....not sure if you have to sign up though.

They give a total breakdown of everything in the tank.....IIRC CharterHouse do Triton now!

Tags:


Related Topics

66 Replies
7683 Views
Last post Oct 23, 2013 8:11:00 pm
by Ryan AC
7 Replies
6551 Views
Last post Apr 25, 2016 10:54:31 am
by Chilax
2 Replies
77 Views
Last post Feb 2, 2015 8:05:06 am
by Carol
2 Replies
1022 Views
Last post May 31, 2015 11:16:53 pm
by HK_Fuey
20 Replies
3970 Views
Last post Aug 17, 2015 10:50:55 pm
by Marty